 Abt 770 - 825 (55 years) Submit Photo / Document
Has 2 ancestors and more than 100 descendants in this family tree.
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| Name |
Ingelram |
| Birth |
Abt 770 |
Nord-Pas-de-Calais, République française  |
| Gender |
Male |
| Death |
825 |
Nord-Pas-de-Calais, République française |
| Initiatory (LDS) |
14 Sep 2001 |
OGDEN |
| FamilySearch ID |
GMXF-5JP |
| Headstones |
 Submit Headstone Photo |
| Person ID |
I15353 |
mytree |
| Last Modified |
25 Feb 2024 |
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| Notes |
- Governor of Flanders 802 -824
Ancestry and Progentry of Captain James Blount - Immigrant, by Robert Fr e derick Pfafman, p E-31.
Engelran, also Ingelran, Ingelram, Ingelramnum and Enguerrand
Recorded as the 2nd ruler of Flanders, and the son of Lidéric.
The name of Engelran's mother and that of his wife are not known. He i s b elieved to be the father of Odacer of Flanders (also Audacer)
Genealogia comitum Flandriae Bertiniana [Gen. Com. Fland. III, pp. 305-8 ] , which states that Lidricus, count of Harlebeck, was father of Ingelra nn us, who was father of Audacrus, who was father of Balduinus Ferreus [" Lid ricus Harlebeccensis comes genuit Ingelrannum. Ingelrannus genuit Aud acru m. Audacer genuit Balduinum Ferreum, qui duxit filiam Karoli Calvi n omin e Iudith."
While it is believed that Ingelram/ Engelran was in deed a real living p e rson, many doubt that he was the father of Odacer and ancestor of Baldw i n I.
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The Legendary Ancestors of Baldwin of Flanders
No contemporary source gives the parentage of Baldwin I of Flanders. How e ver, by the the late thirteenth century, an elaborate story had develop e d which provided Baldwin with three generations of ancestry back to a c er tain Lidéric, who was then said to be the first "forester" of Flanders , f ollowed in the same position by his son Ingelram, grandson Audacer, a nd g reat-grandson Baldwin, who then became the first count of Flanders . Widel y accepted in earlier times, these legends have been correctly re jected b y modern scholarship. Fortunately, the surviving rescensions o f the genea logies of the counts of Flanders allow us to see some of th e stages by wh ich this legendary scenario developed, and even though a c areful examinat ion of these shows us that Ingelram and probably also Lid éric were real i ndividuals, the alleged descent of Baldwin I from them m ust be discarded.
Much of the early development of the legend appears in the various wor k s edited under the collective title of Genealogiae Comitum Flandriae [M G H SS 9: 302-336, here abbreviated Gen. Com. Fland.], a collection of ni n e items (identified here by Roman numerals I-IX) written by various aut ho rs over a period of several hundred years, having in common that the y inv olve the genealogy or succession of the counts of Flanders. The tw o earli est parts, dating from the tenth century, say nothing about the p arentag e of Baldwin I [I. Witger, Genealogia Arnulfi comitis (pp. 302-4 , also a n important source for later Carolingian genealogy); II. De Arnu lfo comit e (p. 304)]. However, Witger was emphasizing the Carolingian an cestry o f count Arnulf I, and De Arnulfo comite was concerned only wit h certain c lose relatives of Arnulf I, so the fact that they do not ment ion the pare ntage of Baldwin I does not mean that they did not know it.
The earliest source giving Baldwin's supposed genealogy back to Lidéri c i s Genealogia comitum Flandriae Bertiniana [Gen. Com. Fland. III, pp . 305- 8], which states that Lidricus, count of Harlebeck, was father o f Ingelra nnus, who was father of Audacrus, who was father of Balduinus F erreus ["L idricus Harlebeccensis comes genuit Ingelrannum. Ingelrannus g enuit Audac rum. Audacer genuit Balduinum Ferreum, qui duxit filiam Karol i Calvi nomi ne Iudith." MGH SS 9: 305]. In his introduction to this work , Bethmann da tes this version to the reign of count Robert II (1093-1111 ) [MGH SS 9: 3 05], but the existence of two different versions which div erge after Bald win V suggests an earlier version composed under Baldwi n V or Baldwin V I [see MGH SS 9: 306]. As discussed in more detail below , later version s of Gen. Com. Fland. added major elaborations to this ac count.
However, Genealogia comitum Flandriae Bertiniana is not the earliest sou r ce to mention Lidéric. That honor goes to Annales Blandinienses, which , u nder the year 836, in an eleventh century hand, states that "Lidricu s com es obiit", followed by "et Arlabeka sepelitur" added in a twelfth c entur y hand [Grierson (1937a), 11; Annales Blandinienses has also been e dite d by Ludwig Bethmann in MGH SS 5: 20-34, but the fact that "et Arlab eka s epelitur" was in a later hand is not indicated]. One of the source s use d by the Annales Blandinienses as we have them today was an earlie r versi on of the same annals from the middle of the tenth century, calle d the te nth century Annales Blandinienses by Grierson (1937a), which wer e also us ed as a source by Annales Elmarenses, Annales Formosolenses, an d Annale s Elnonenses. These annals are also edited in Grierson (1937a) . Annales E lmarenses were first edited by Grierson, while Monumenta Germ aniae Histor ica contains editions of Annales Formosolenses by Bethmann [ MGH SS 5: 34- 6] and of Annales Elnonenses by Pertz [MGH SS 5: 10-20, wit h the entrie s in one twelfth century hand separated and edited as Annale s Elnonense s minores (pp.17-20), and the remaining annals edited as Anna les Elnonens es maiores (pp. 11-17)]. The Annales Blandinienses also ment ion Ingelra m and Audacer, but with an important difference: although th e affiliatio n of Audacer as father of Baldwin is given, no genealogica l affiliation s are given for Lidéric or Ingelram. The Chronicon Vedastin um, discusse d in more detail under Audacer below, is another relativel y early sourc e which gives the name of Baldwin's father without showin g any knowledg e of his alleged earlier ancestors. This indicates an earl ier tradition i n which the name of the father of Baldwin I was regarde d as known, but i n which there is no evidence that any earlier generatio ns in the genealog y were known.
From this, along with the more detailed individual discussions for Lidér i c, Ingelram, and Audacer which appear below, two major points emerge:
No later than the middle of the eleventh century (and probably as earl y a s the tenth), there were local annalists who believed that Baldwin' s fath er was named Audacer/Odoacer, but who did not indicate any signifi cant de tails about the latter, or any knowledge of genealogical affiliat ions fo r Lidéric or Ingelram.
The chronology indicated for Lidéric and Ingelram (whose career overla p s ignificantly with that of Baldwin I), as shown by these early source s , does not fit well with the claim that they were respectively great-gr an dfather and grandfather of Baldwin I of Flanders.
The natural conclusion is that the name of the father of Baldwin I belon g s to an earlier level of the tradition, while the alleged affiliatio n o f Lidéric and Ingelram to Audacer and Baldwin is a later invention, m ad e when the genealogists were seeking to extend the ancestry beyond Bal dwi n's father, and found two usable names for that purpose in their sour ces . Although not supported by contemporary evidence, the name of Baldwi n' s father can be accepted as probable, but the genealogical links to In gel ram and Lidéric need to be rejected as later inventions, even thoug h we c an probably accept Lidéric's existence (as we certainly can for In gelram) .
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Has 2 ancestors and more than 100 descendants in this family tree.
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